don't click here

Penultimate Unleashed news topic


    Print

Author Topic: Penultimate Unleashed news topic  (Read 73142 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Rolken

Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« on: November 22, 2008, 09:07:10 am »
The Wii and 360 Unleashed are now both out in America. Judging from various reactions and reviews, the framework is the same old 3D Sonic story, with speedy Sonic levels that are inexplicably paired with unSonic levels that take up the majority of the game and an assortment of hub world questing and minigame action. It's pretty clear at this point that, for better or worse, SEGA management doesn't want to mess with the formula they've established. But notably, a lot of fans seem to be happy with the 360 speed level design; the Wii/PS2 versions are truncated and redesigned to fit within the technical constraints of the console.

I haven't yet played any version so I can't offer any personal opinions, but I figured a new game warrants a space on the front page. I'm hoping the speed levels will be good enough to justify slogging through the rest of it. <_<

To offer a rough estimate, competition charts will probably go up within a week or two. How fast or slow it goes largely depends on how easily the community can reach a consensus on how things ought to be ranked, and I don't have any knowledge on that front.

Update: A clarification on the HD-gimp distinction. There is -drastically- less speed Sonic content in the PS2/Wii version; only one speed level per continent (zone) instead of two, and they are quite a bit shorter as well. Basically, if you have both options available, all signs point towards the 360/PS3 version with the exception of the PS2 version being $20 cheaper. The framerate issues that come up now and again in conversation have not been eradicated completely, but are sufficiently tamped down that it should not be a serious factor in a purchase decision.

Gerbil Update: Charts for both the Wii/PS2 and 360/PS3 versions are up. Submit your stats! :D
« Last Edit: December 08, 2008, 12:15:37 pm by GerbilSoft »
StH JJ1 WkS+ Sal++^i Rbk++i Knu- McS+++ P++ D[af]opw $++++ E03 A24 GM CoUT
What fun is it being cool if you can't wear a sombrero?

Offline ChaoRC

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2008, 05:16:07 pm »
To offer a rough estimate, competition charts will probably go up within a week or two. How fast or slow it goes largely depends on how easily the community can reach a consensus on how things ought to be ranked, and I don't have any knowledge on that front.
Just by watching videos alone, Wii does not track score at all compared to the 360/PS3 version. And in the Wii, Werehog RA would be somewhat uncompetition worthy as you can't lose rings, have no ? boxes, and aren't tracked until you view the results screen.

Offline Azure

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2008, 05:25:03 pm »
From what I've seen, it actually looks pretty fun to Time Attack. Maybe I'll look into buying it.

Offline flying fox

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #3 on: November 22, 2008, 05:30:05 pm »
I was thinking the same thing earlier while I was looking at some videos on Youtube. I wish I could play it now but I have to wait till the 28th which is the release date for Europe :(

Offline Parax

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #4 on: November 22, 2008, 08:33:32 pm »
Unleashed 360 tracks time and score, but not rings. On Werehog levels you can see score and rings, but you can't see your time until the level ends. Ring bonus is ring count * 100, so you can still figure out what it was from the results screen. From the looks of it, it wouldn't be very hard to get over 1000 rings in most levels.

Quote
And in the Wii, Werehog RA would be somewhat uncompetition worthy as you can't lose rings, have no ? boxes, and aren't tracked until you view the results screen.

360 version is the same way, except you can see the ring count before the results screen.

I'd like seeing Werehog rings tracked in Unleashed personally, probably just because I like RAs, and time and score are no-brainers. Don't know about the WiiS2 version, whoever has that version can decide. TAing werehog actually seems like it might be fun, since it seems like there's a lot of shortcut potential in a lot of the levels.

I'll post a competition topic for PS360 later when I've finished, if no one beats me to it. Shouldn't be hard to figure out some temporary charts.

Offline Rolken

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #5 on: November 22, 2008, 09:11:06 pm »
Shouldn't be hard to figure out some temporary charts.
TSC has never done temporary charts. Solid data or bust.
StH JJ1 WkS+ Sal++^i Rbk++i Knu- McS+++ P++ D[af]opw $++++ E03 A24 GM CoUT
What fun is it being cool if you can't wear a sombrero?

Offline Parax

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #6 on: November 22, 2008, 09:22:32 pm »
I meant for the thread for review until everyone can agree that they're acceptable for TSC. What RR did in the Unwiished thread, basically.

Offline ieatatsonic

  • TSC's Resident Otaku
  • TSC Profile
  • winxp chrome
  • Posts: 287
  • I started spriting
    • View Profile
Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #7 on: November 23, 2008, 12:25:52 am »
So will there be charts for both versions of the game, or just the 360?
Happiness cannot be bought but instead be achieved via countless hours of self-torture.

Offline EngiNerd

  • Most Sarcastic Member of the Year
  • TSC Profile
  • win7 chrome
  • Posts: 798
  • Hydrowhut
    • View Profile
Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #8 on: November 23, 2008, 07:19:23 am »
Heads up to everybody: Night of the Werehog has been released.  Impressions will come later (i.e. when I actually watch it).
Night of the Werehog

EDIT: Watched it.  DEFINITELY attempts to emulate the Pixar shorts ... and it kinda works.  I, for one, was quite amused by it.  The complete lack of dialogue definitely helps ... the entire thing is done in pantomime, which both adds to the comic effect and completely removes pretty much everything that is wrong with typical Sonic cutscenes.  I dunno, you'll probably disagree, but I liked this.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2008, 08:25:59 am by Minus the Antiporcupine »
Im in ur TSCz, climin ur chartz!
My presssioussss....

Offline Aitamen

  • TSC Profile
  • win7 firefox
  • Posts: 1130
  • I am a follower of the immortal Dark Falz!
    • View Profile
Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #9 on: November 23, 2008, 04:27:13 pm »
I am pro this movie, and it achieves the retro-gamer 1st half approval
Year 33 — The Malkavians claim that their greatest practical joke happened during this year, when they perform a bit of graverobbing  in Jerusalem.
-- Vampire: The Masquerade

Offline Selphos

  • The Eternally Young Scarlet Moon
  • Broseidon
  • TSC: Sondow
  • win10 firefox
  • Posts: 980
  • TSC's local Touhou nut
    • View Profile
Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2008, 06:32:58 pm »
I agree, the movie is pretty good. I haven't played Unleashed yet, but I'd wager it's better than some of the actual Werehog levels >____>

Though that's like comparing a piece of cheese to a cheesecake. Oh well
The moon is so red. Looks like it's going to be a fun night.

Offline Crowbar

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #11 on: November 23, 2008, 07:23:25 pm »
Yeah, actually for all my mammoth bitching it wasn't all that bad. Not amazing but it did a good few things right.

Offline Taillow

  • Changing forum names is lame...
  • Broseidon
  • TSC: Quartz
  • win81 chrome
  • Posts: 646
  • ...but it didn't stop me from doing it again.
    • View Profile
Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #12 on: November 23, 2008, 08:17:02 pm »
Well, I just saw Night of the Werehog, and I have this to say...

The werehog has cleats?

With that said, pretty funny.
Hi

Offline EngiNerd

  • Most Sarcastic Member of the Year
  • TSC Profile
  • win7 chrome
  • Posts: 798
  • Hydrowhut
    • View Profile
Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #13 on: November 24, 2008, 07:45:59 am »
The werehog has cleats?
LOL, wow.  Sorry, man, I for one noticed it at LEAST a couple of months ago.  I.E. when the first Werehog press stuff started.
Im in ur TSCz, climin ur chartz!
My presssioussss....

Offline Azure

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #14 on: November 24, 2008, 08:41:46 am »
Quote from: Minus
I, for one, was quite amused by it.

I, for one, will have to wait to watch this movie. The only internet access I have is at home (dial-up) or at school (blocked, proxifying doesn't work with flash). I'll have to visit my local library...

On another note, does anybody own Unleashed yet? Are the levels fast and pleasurable, or not so?

Offline KnucklesSonic8

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #15 on: November 24, 2008, 01:32:33 pm »
Guys need help with Wii divisions? I can gladly help out. :)

If there's anything anyone wants to know about the Wii version, ask away.

And that'd be dumb if there were ONLY 360 Charts. That doesn't make sense and plus its not fair.

I can assist if need be, as I said.
Wiiloveit

Current Competition Focus: ---
Wants S&S All-Stars Racing

Offline Selphos

  • The Eternally Young Scarlet Moon
  • Broseidon
  • TSC: Sondow
  • win10 firefox
  • Posts: 980
  • TSC's local Touhou nut
    • View Profile
Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #16 on: November 24, 2008, 03:08:17 pm »
Who ever said we would only add PS360 charts?
The moon is so red. Looks like it's going to be a fun night.

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #17 on: November 24, 2008, 04:12:01 pm »
So will there be charts for both versions of the game, or just the 360?

I think KS8 was referring to this

Offline Aitamen

  • TSC Profile
  • win7 firefox
  • Posts: 1130
  • I am a follower of the immortal Dark Falz!
    • View Profile
Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #18 on: November 24, 2008, 05:09:46 pm »
KS8, you need to update your sig, btw...
Year 33 — The Malkavians claim that their greatest practical joke happened during this year, when they perform a bit of graverobbing  in Jerusalem.
-- Vampire: The Masquerade

Offline Ring Rush

WII CHARTS TO BE ADDED
« Reply #19 on: November 24, 2008, 07:58:36 pm »
TIME AND BOSS CHARTS FOR UNLEASHED WII

Time format: same as S06

~Sonic Unleashed TSC Chart~
Times-[/u]
Total Time
Day Total Time
Night Total Time
Apotos
 - Day 1
 - Day 2
 - Night 1
 - Night 2
 - Night 3
Spagonia
 - Day
 - Night 1
 - Night 2
 - Night 3
Chun-Nan
 - Day
 - Night 1
 - Night 2
 - Night 3
Holoska
 - Day
 - Night 1
 - Night 2
 - Night 3
Shamar
 - Day
 - Night 1
 - Night 2
 - Night 3
 - Night 4
Adabat
 - Day
 - Night 1
 - Night 2
 - Night 3
 - Night 4
Eggmanland
 - Day
 - Night 1
 - Night 2
 - Night 3
 - Night 4
 - Night 5

Bosses
Total Time
Total Time Sonic
Total Time Werehog
Note: [Sonic/Werehog] will be after each boss, and will be the division and total time the boss will go into.
Egg Beetle [Sonic]
Dark Gaia Phoenix [Werehog]
Egg Devil Ray [Sonic]
Dark Moray [Werehog]
Dark Guardian [Werehog]
Egg Lancer [Sonic]
Egg Dragoon [Werehog] (Yes, this is an egg boss and still fought with werehog)
Dark Gaia [Sonic] (See last comment and reverse it)



Ring charts may come later after further debates. No score charts will be added do to respawning enemies at night and no scores in the day.


Edit: Yeah, day rings seem good enough to be added. Night rings may come soon after testing about death / competativenes
Rings-Total Rings
Apotos
- Day 1
- Day 2
Spagonia
- Day
Chun-Nan
- Day
Holoska
- Day
Shamar
- Day
Adabat
- Day
Eggmanland
- Day
« Last Edit: November 26, 2008, 10:56:48 am by Ring Rush »
Current Championships: SSR (5/26/08-Now)
Current Leaderships: SSR Chains [0 Point], SC Rings [0 Point], SSR Scores [0 Point], S3D Rings [0 Point], SSR Times, SSR Bosses
Past Leaderships: SA2 Rings, S1GG Rings, SUWii Rings, SBK Times, SBK Chains, SRA Rings, SRA Scores

Offline Thorn

  • wroar
  • Architect emeritus
  • TSC Profile
  • win10 chrome
  • Posts: 1309
  • Former admin, lucid dreamer, lover of burgers
    • View Profile
Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #20 on: November 26, 2008, 10:41:03 am »
^Well, if this is the topic to do that in... here's a roundabout idea of what the 360/PS3 charts would look like. I say roundabout because there's always points of discussion, and because I'm doing this entirely from memory and may lose an act here or there. Heck, we can even debate level order what with a bit of branching progression available.

T = Time competition
S = Score competition
B = Boss competition (please don't pull what we did in Sonic '06... PLEASE use a Boss division instead of one long-ass Time list...)

At the moment I'm sort of leaning towards no Ring competitions due to a few of the Day stages being 999-able, general TSC disdain for Ring competitions as of late, the sheer frustration of touching every ring in the 3D sections (see: Savannah Citadel 1 Day, very beginning), and the strange way in which you lose rings (I've seen hits cause me to lose as little as one ring and as many as half of my stash, i.e. up to 500 rings). For similar reasons, I'm avoiding Mission charts.

DayNight
TotalTSBTSB



Windmill Isle 1TSTS
Windmill Isle 2TSTS
Windmill Isle 3TS
Savannah Citadel 1TSTS
Savannah Citadel 2TSTS
Savannah Citadel 3TS
Cool Edge 1TSTS
Cool Edge 2TS
Dragon Road 1TSTS
Dragon Road 2TSTS
Dragon Road 3TS
Rooftop Run 1TSTS
Rooftop Run 2TS
Rooftop Run 3TS
Arid Sands 1TSTS
Arid Sands 2TS
Skyscraper Scamper 1TSTS
Skyscraper Scamper 2TS
Jungle Joyride 1TSTS
Jungle Joyride 2TSTS
Jungle Joyride 3TS
EggmanlandTS
Tornado Defense 1S
Tornado Defense 2S



Egg BeetleB
Dark Gaia PhoenixB
Dark MorayB
Egg Devil RayB
Dark GuardianB
Egg LancerB
Egg DragoonB
Dark GaiaB

* Bosses are actually tracked by score when it comes to rank, but for a few of them, it's better for your rank to loop the area ad infinitum and collect respawning rings rather than gunning for a time bonus.

Start debating... now.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2008, 04:35:36 pm by Thorn »
<RPGnutter> Well I think your reasoning was dumb, so you get sassed
<RPGnutter> Thats how it works

Offline Ring Rush

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #21 on: November 26, 2008, 10:50:55 am »
Okay, point of debate: Windmill Isle or Apotos? Jungle Joyride or Adabat? etc.

As having the wii charts by island names and the 360 charts by area names is a bit dumb.
Current Championships: SSR (5/26/08-Now)
Current Leaderships: SSR Chains [0 Point], SC Rings [0 Point], SSR Scores [0 Point], S3D Rings [0 Point], SSR Times, SSR Bosses
Past Leaderships: SA2 Rings, S1GG Rings, SUWii Rings, SBK Times, SBK Chains, SRA Rings, SRA Scores

Offline Thorn

  • wroar
  • Architect emeritus
  • TSC Profile
  • win10 chrome
  • Posts: 1309
  • Former admin, lucid dreamer, lover of burgers
    • View Profile
Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #22 on: November 26, 2008, 10:58:08 am »
Well, when playing the 360 version, entering a portal in the entrance stage causes a message box to pop up with a level's best time, score, medals collected out of the total, and name. These same names appear on the stage select menu from the world map. So... I used them. :P
<RPGnutter> Well I think your reasoning was dumb, so you get sassed
<RPGnutter> Thats how it works

Offline Ring Rush

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #23 on: November 26, 2008, 11:09:42 am »
On wii version, to get to a stage you first select the continent, then the stage. No need for level names.

When the level starts you see

                    ADABAT
Collect 50 rings | Jungle Joyride

So the continent is above the level.
Current Championships: SSR (5/26/08-Now)
Current Leaderships: SSR Chains [0 Point], SC Rings [0 Point], SSR Scores [0 Point], S3D Rings [0 Point], SSR Times, SSR Bosses
Past Leaderships: SA2 Rings, S1GG Rings, SUWii Rings, SBK Times, SBK Chains, SRA Rings, SRA Scores

Offline Parax

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #24 on: November 26, 2008, 12:48:36 pm »
According to FKE, the ring counter will go over 999, so easily maxing isn't an issue. Not much reason not to have ring competition. Missions should be tracked as well if we want to stay consistent with the rest of the charts, as it gives you a few seconds to see your time when you finish. Dark Gaia is trackable too, as your time is shown on the stage select (apparently you need to beat it a second time to have it show anything, but according to fke it keeps track of the whole fight). Also Tornado Defense Act 1/2 scores.

Eggmanland can't have score/ring competition because there's a conveyer belt early on in the level with infinite rings.

There's a few other issues too with scores: first off how would score competition on bosses work? A lot of Sonic's bosses have infinite rings, so maybe just drop score/ring boss competition? Also two issues with Werehog score attacking, specifically about combos: first, as being lower-leveled allows you to deal less damage to an enemy, if you don't have strength leveled up you'd be able to get higher combos on enemies. The second is potentially infinite comboing off one enemy by having a nearby wizard repeatedly heal... I'm not sure how easy/possible it is to do this but it seems plausible.

We also figured out a lot about how the game calculates score (with Sonic at least) in chat a few days ago. First, speed bonus is related to how fast you go through checkpoints, but how exactly it's calculated I have no idea. The in-stage score is the sum of the enemy and trick bonuses, so it can be discounted. The reason scores don't add up properly on the results screen is because the game doesn't show you your time bonus; add up all the bonuses then add the missing bonus to your time and you'll usually get x:x9.99. every .01 seconds is worth one point, basically. Ring bonus is easy, your ring count * 100.

I'll post a mission listing once I've finished them all, if we decide we're going to track them (I've finished most of them, just a few left somewhere I think...).
« Last Edit: November 26, 2008, 01:28:16 pm by Paraxade »

Offline Thorn

  • wroar
  • Architect emeritus
  • TSC Profile
  • win10 chrome
  • Posts: 1309
  • Former admin, lucid dreamer, lover of burgers
    • View Profile
Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #25 on: November 26, 2008, 01:57:35 pm »
^Rings respawn on many levels, particularly the ones that are lap races in disguise (sometimes, they respawn in different places per lap, such as in Rooftop Run 2). It might be better to ax the entire division. Although I will say that in cases of rings respawning in the exact same location, we've already had that issue in Sonic 1. We've worked around it, and kept charts.

Scores on Night levels, what with infinite combos, I don't know much about. But from what I can see, your score goes up WAY faster via critical attacks than it does via combos. My combo bonuses, even for 50 hit combos or so, have been in the hundreds of points, whereas the smallest critical attack I've seen awards 6000 points.

Where you say we should add missions to be consistent with the rest of the charts, notice that Riders and Riders 2 never had missions tracked, but Secret Rings and Rush Adventure did. SkyLights made an argument for axing missions in Rush Adventure, too. What consistency?

Also, since when did we ever track scores or rings in bosses anyway (3D Blast aside, since it doesn't have a separate division)? It's only time tracking. I'll check the final bosses again, though, and I did indeed forget to add Tornado Defense to scores. Added now.

EDIT: Dark Gaia does get ranked.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2008, 04:34:50 pm by Thorn »
<RPGnutter> Well I think your reasoning was dumb, so you get sassed
<RPGnutter> Thats how it works

Offline Parax

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #26 on: November 26, 2008, 02:05:31 pm »
You can't make infinite laps around the lap races, though, can you? There aren't that many lap races anyway; I've only seen two or three, though I haven't played all the stages yet. Do rings respawn on any other levels? Additionally, if a lot of levels really do have infinite rings, then scores on those stages need to be axed too (infinite ring bonuses).

True about critical attacks. It'd mostly be useful for weakening enemies before critical'ing them, or against enemies that can't be critical'd. I really don't know much about how combos work for points, so the strength thing is probably not an issue at all since you'd lose a lot on time bonus. Infinite combos will need to be looked into though.

Didn't know about Riders/Riders 2 not having missions tracked. A lot of the missions are pretty lame, so whatever we decide to do about them's fine with me. And scores and rings were tracked for bosses in Sonic 06.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2008, 02:12:51 pm by Paraxade »

Offline KnucklesSonic8

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #27 on: November 26, 2008, 02:32:14 pm »
Excellent work guys. Hopw this comes together soon.

FYI, Missions in Riders = Some had potential. I proposed em. But I won't get into it since its not pertinent to the case.

Missions in Unleashed (Wii), though = Stats/Records aren't recorded like w/ the main missions so maybe not, imho.

Can't wait to start competing. SU is GREAT for TA's. :)

@Aita: I know. XD

◎ Wii ◎
Wiiloveit

Current Competition Focus: ---
Wants S&S All-Stars Racing

Offline Thorn

  • wroar
  • Architect emeritus
  • TSC Profile
  • win10 chrome
  • Posts: 1309
  • Former admin, lucid dreamer, lover of burgers
    • View Profile
Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #28 on: November 26, 2008, 04:41:55 pm »
There aren't that many lap races anyway; I've only seen two or three, though I haven't played all the stages yet.

Not counting the "finish one lap" missions, I know of Rooftop Run 2, Cool Edge 2, Savannah Citadel 2 & 3, Dragon Road 2, and Jungle Joyride 2 (all Day).

And scores and rings were tracked for bosses in Sonic 06.

Mainly because, in lieu of your previous call for consistency, somebody decided that the way we ranked bosses in SA1, SA2, Heroes, and Shadow wasn't good enough for Sonic '06, and said person opted not to use the boss division. I'm sure there was a reason, but I'm going to fall back on "'06 sucked" and instantly win that argument. TSC law, or something. :P
<RPGnutter> Well I think your reasoning was dumb, so you get sassed
<RPGnutter> Thats how it works

Offline Parax

Re: Penultimate Unleashed news topic
« Reply #29 on: November 26, 2008, 05:14:37 pm »
Likely because 06 was the only game to track boss scores/rings. Either way they're largely irrelevant, so yeah, let's have a boss division for Unleashed please.

I guess all we need now is to figure out whether to have rings/missions and to make sure there's no issue with werehog scores? Times are probably good to go already. I'm in favor of having a rings division. Missions are probably not going to be competed in as much, plus they don't give you much time to check your time, don't save your best, etc... let's just skip those unless there's a reason not to. I'll mess with the infinite combo thing today and see whether there's actually an issue.

    Print
 

Hits: 1,382 | Hits This Month: 6 | DB Calls: 8 | Mem Usage: 1.30 MB | Time: 0.13s | Printable

The Sonic Center v3.9
Copyright 2003-2011 by The Sonic Center Team.